Author Topic: Opinions  (Read 8331 times)

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Offline Lava Del'Vortel

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Opinions
« on: December 04, 2011, 03:44:09 PM »
You like the mod? You feel it's 'bleh'? Let me know :)
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Done projects:
Colours of Infinity: TotDG, Innershade, TWQ, ISNF, Yvette, Foundling
Quests: Eilistraee's Song
NPCs and related: Varshoon | Aeon | Petsy | Tsuki BG2 | Yoshimo Romance | La'Valygar | Quayle BG2 | Swylif | Skie BG2 | White | GaheshLa'Viconia
In-progress projects: Sarine (contribution) | The Purple Splinter | Foundling
Contribution: Ilmatar's Portrait Pack | PaintBG | InfinityKits | Sarevok Friendship

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2011, 01:38:56 PM »
Hmm, I am bundling my opinions with my bug reports, but just to reiterate: I think luck on the katana from the start is overpowered. :)

Offline Lava Del'Vortel

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2011, 01:48:35 PM »
I replied to the "bug report" post.
I hope to read some more opinions about the romance. I hope you all enjoy the mod :)
Lava's Scriptorium

Done projects:
Colours of Infinity: TotDG, Innershade, TWQ, ISNF, Yvette, Foundling
Quests: Eilistraee's Song
NPCs and related: Varshoon | Aeon | Petsy | Tsuki BG2 | Yoshimo Romance | La'Valygar | Quayle BG2 | Swylif | Skie BG2 | White | GaheshLa'Viconia
In-progress projects: Sarine (contribution) | The Purple Splinter | Foundling
Contribution: Ilmatar's Portrait Pack | PaintBG | InfinityKits | Sarevok Friendship

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2011, 02:25:17 PM »
Well, re the luck vs powergaming thing.  Heh, I never really considered myself a powergamer ;)  What I do notice, however, is that at harder difficulties, you scrape by with every advantage you can take.  Persistent luck means Yoshimo is getting critical hits _all the time_ in my game, and I notice that a whole lot.  Especially when I keep "screen shake on crit" on in my game options.  Yoshimo runs into battle, my screen starts shaking all the time.   Of course anyone can turn of screen shake and maybe crit hits don't count as much outside, but inside irenicus dungeon it makes Yoshimo the swath cutter through all the enemies you find there.

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2011, 02:04:38 PM »
So I was playing with Yoshimo in the party, and I think with the romance active - at least, when I initiate PC conversations with Yoshimo, he is calling my PC "sweet plum" which seems to me to be a red flag for an active romance - and around the talk 8 or 9, I guess, I had a bit of a struggle to follow the conversation, completely unrelated to the English grammar.

Let's preface this with a positive - as I go through more of the romance, I find that the sometimes "chunky" flow of his grammar fits quite well with the fact that Yoshimo is not a native "common" speaker and even tells you this in one of his talks.  It's very well done, and if it was on purpose great, and if it wasn't on purpose, it still works very well for the character.  So kudos for that.  ;D

Now, my ??? moment started with the conversation Yoshimo initiates, which begins with

"It pains me to admit my own failability..."

Apart from the fact that the word should be "fallibility" here, I was left scrabbling to figure out what Yoshimo was talking about.  Before this conversation booted up, we had had 2 Yoshimo initiated talks, the first about honor and the second about keeping mementos from Candlekeep.  Before the next talk started, I had also had 3 or 4 PC-initiated conversations with Yoshimo about his family, his sister, his mother, etc.  All conversations, both the Yoshimo-initiated ones and the PC-initiated ones, ended pleasantly, with the characters either complimenting or agreeing with one another, or so I thought.

This conversation which then started up, was in essence Yoshimo referring to a snippy attitude he had had in a previous conversation.  He then stated that he wouldn't act "differently" anymore and for a while I thought that meant he was ending the romance (well, the PC had been having her 1-sided unrequited-Kivan-bemoaning on the side, so it would have been understandable  :evil ), particularly since one of the PC responses was something like "I'm not moving until you tell me what's going on!" or something like that.   

Then on reading further into the conversation, which eventually ended up with the PC and Yoshimo playing a very surrealistic game of dice, I figured out that Yoshimo was actually apologizing for having had a snippy attitude in a *previous* conversation, and what he was really saying was "let's continue the romance, actually!"

I'm not sure where the disconnnect occurred, so I actually opened up the .d file and took a closer look at the previous dialogue options.  My best guess is that Yoshimo was referring to the conversation in which he asked about mementos from Candlekeep, and eventually ended up telling the PC something like "remember to keep a bucket of cold water nearby to put out the fire" or something like that.

I think the problem here is that I chose dialogue options while having the "memento" conversation that ended up sounding very friendly, in my opinion.  So I was flummoxed when Yoshimo started apologizing for an attitude that I hadn't seen that he had.

I think if the "Candlekeep memento" dialogue is actually supposed to force a conflict with the PC, it needs to be toned up a bit so that the player can tell that Yoshimo is either getting nervous or upset at the main character when she gets too friendly with him.  Otherwise the next talk can lead to a little confusion, as it did for me, in thinking the opposite of what was actually being said.

That, or Yoshimo just has a strange way of accepting that the PC he is interested in is making moon eyes at the nearest elven archer, LOL.


Of lesser importance, the random "bird walks in and steals your dice" (die is the plural of dice, which is singular, btw) resolution to the gambling game was a bit out of the blue.  I'm not sure if it was a reference to some pop culture gag, but I surely didn't get it.  Maybe if it was a Norwegian Blue parrot I might have gotten it, LOL! 

Anyway, for my taste, the bird joke was a little bit too random, especially since that conversation took place while the party was inside of an inn, rather than in the wilderness.  But if you do keep the bird joke in there - if Jan Jansen is in the party (and he wasn't in mine), he absolutely NEEDS to make some kind of comedic interjection about the bird stealing the dice.  Because that is right up his alley.  Something like yelling "Stop, you turnip-hating dice thief!" and chucking one of his Smasher Basher Bruiser Masters at the poor hapless bird, thereby providing the party with a fine roast for dinner that evening.  Or something suitably random.  Because random humour and turnips are definitely the province of Jan Jansen. ;)

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2011, 03:38:46 PM »
Eh, I meant, "DICE" is the PLURAL of the singular noun "DIE"

got it backwards there   :whistle:

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2011, 12:22:51 PM »
So, I just got to the first "challenge" of the relationship, now that the flirty not-serious honeymoon is over (this is after the dog conversation).  So far it has been nice and believable, and the writing continues to be.  I do want to bring up one thing that was an issue for me, though.  I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this particular point, but one opinion I have about a lot of mods, is that I really, really don't like parenthetic conversations.  By this I mean conversations where a lot of described action occurs which is not dialogue.

Just for the record, even though I enjoy the writing of the Kivan mod, I don't enjoy the parentheses in that mod, either, honestly.  It makes the Kivan mod feel more like a good fiction than a good choose your own adventure at times.  That among other mods is probably one of the original "offenders" that made this sort of "action writing" popular, I guess.

I'm mentioning this here because the "Yoshimo gets cold feet" discussion is probably a fairly important one - I would assume - and all of a sudden, the amount of parenthetical action multiplied by a factor of three!  Whereas in all of the previous conversations, there might be no parentheses, or maybe one or two at the most, suddenly there is a parenthesis option in nearly every dialogue as well as in Yoshimo's responses.  I understand that if a kiss is written into the mod, it's hard to describe that with dialogue, but lightening up on the descriptive action and replacing with a little more action-revealing dialogue instead would be more helpful.  Even if it's just a dialogue cue with only one choice, to show that the action is mandatory, for me that would be better than a lot of parentheses.  Or maybe some of the action doesn't need to be described, like Yoshimo "sitting up" for example.  I don't know, making suggestions that sort of editing is very personal and difficult to do without messing with an author's vision, though.

Still, I feel less parentheses would be nice.  Feel free to disagree with that, but it is my opinion. :-)

Offline Lava Del'Vortel

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #7 on: December 25, 2011, 01:03:20 PM »
I'm still learning how to avoid action text and descriptions. I included a lot of those in Yvette Romance. There's just some action text in Yoshimo Romance and... I think it's helpful to include that in romance. Some people enjoy...details in description, especially in romances. Huh, I suppose you know what I mean.

Well, I know that not every player enjoy thouse, though. Thanks for your opinion :)
Lava's Scriptorium

Done projects:
Colours of Infinity: TotDG, Innershade, TWQ, ISNF, Yvette, Foundling
Quests: Eilistraee's Song
NPCs and related: Varshoon | Aeon | Petsy | Tsuki BG2 | Yoshimo Romance | La'Valygar | Quayle BG2 | Swylif | Skie BG2 | White | GaheshLa'Viconia
In-progress projects: Sarine (contribution) | The Purple Splinter | Foundling
Contribution: Ilmatar's Portrait Pack | PaintBG | InfinityKits | Sarevok Friendship

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2012, 03:34:09 PM »
Now, I think this is YR.  When I took Anomen into the party, in a fit of bad judgement of course, the romance with Yoshimo was already underway, so very soon after a "romance conflict" dialogue came up, started by Anomen.  He was an in-character ass as per usual, so good job there.  However:  when you finally get tired of him spouting his self-righteous pap, you have a couple of options.  One is the fawning "I choose Anomen!" option.  One is the spiteful "Shut your pie hole, I choose Yoshimo!" option.  And the third, is just a plain old spiteful "Shut the hell up!"

While the first two are okay, I have a problem with the third option.  The "I choose Yoshimo, you jerk!" option is pretty mean, and I like it that way.  But, what if you want to choose Yoshimo, but ultimately keep Anomen in your party, or are RPing that you want to be at least friends with him?  Even if 90% of the world hates Anomen's guts, he is a killer cleric/fighter and some people actually like him.  You should give them an option to turn Anomen down without calling him a stinking racist barbarian, basically.  I'd soften up option #3 to be a gentle let-down, rather than a rude sendoff.  My 2 cents!

Offline Lava Del'Vortel

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2012, 04:17:43 PM »
Hmm, you may be right. I will try to include additional line next time I update the mod :)
Lava's Scriptorium

Done projects:
Colours of Infinity: TotDG, Innershade, TWQ, ISNF, Yvette, Foundling
Quests: Eilistraee's Song
NPCs and related: Varshoon | Aeon | Petsy | Tsuki BG2 | Yoshimo Romance | La'Valygar | Quayle BG2 | Swylif | Skie BG2 | White | GaheshLa'Viconia
In-progress projects: Sarine (contribution) | The Purple Splinter | Foundling
Contribution: Ilmatar's Portrait Pack | PaintBG | InfinityKits | Sarevok Friendship

Offline Enkida

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2012, 01:42:03 PM »
Hmm, I got all the way up to the dog dialogue again so far, and Keto is working properly in my party, so she has had a few dialogues with Yoshimo as well.  I really think you're going to need to put in your readme somewhere that Keto is, at the very least, narratively incompatible with a Yoshimo romance.  They flirt, they trade stories about not having significant others, etc.  There's no technical bugs with playing them together, but from a role play perspective, Yoshimo seems fine playing the field.  :-P

That, or code in exceptions to his flirts with Keto somehow, which is a ton more work!

Offline Lava Del'Vortel

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2012, 03:02:25 PM »
Yeah, warning about Keto-Yoshimo thing was on my list, yet in the end I forgot about it... Sorry... I did some tweaks to make it work with Yoshimo Friendship and a facility that blocks the romance if charname follows Tortured Souls plot, but I forgot about Keto... eh....

Still, I hope you enjoy the romance. I remember you do not wish leave Imoen in the Asylum, but no worries. You will get a place for her in your party and you will be able to continue the "romance" thing.
Lava's Scriptorium

Done projects:
Colours of Infinity: TotDG, Innershade, TWQ, ISNF, Yvette, Foundling
Quests: Eilistraee's Song
NPCs and related: Varshoon | Aeon | Petsy | Tsuki BG2 | Yoshimo Romance | La'Valygar | Quayle BG2 | Swylif | Skie BG2 | White | GaheshLa'Viconia
In-progress projects: Sarine (contribution) | The Purple Splinter | Foundling
Contribution: Ilmatar's Portrait Pack | PaintBG | InfinityKits | Sarevok Friendship

Offline Blacklily

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2012, 10:29:37 AM »
I have two questions. *spoilers*
When is the vampire who takes his heart supposed to show up? Because somehow I managed to keep it and take it to the Temple of Ilmater. :P And uh...what npc should I look for to get the gift for Yoshimo? I've searched the Promenade, but found no new npc.

Offline Lava Del'Vortel

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2012, 12:05:28 PM »
Maybe you didn't success in the romance. Vampire should show up in the Asylum just after you pick up the heart, but ONLY if romance was finished successfuly. What was your last talk with Yoshimo? Check YoshimoRomanceActive variable - is it 1, 2 or 3?
Lava's Scriptorium

Done projects:
Colours of Infinity: TotDG, Innershade, TWQ, ISNF, Yvette, Foundling
Quests: Eilistraee's Song
NPCs and related: Varshoon | Aeon | Petsy | Tsuki BG2 | Yoshimo Romance | La'Valygar | Quayle BG2 | Swylif | Skie BG2 | White | GaheshLa'Viconia
In-progress projects: Sarine (contribution) | The Purple Splinter | Foundling
Contribution: Ilmatar's Portrait Pack | PaintBG | InfinityKits | Sarevok Friendship

Offline Blacklily

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Re: Opinions
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2012, 09:56:18 AM »
Can you give me a command that will allow me to check YoshimoRomanceActive?